Precognitive Dreams

Discussion in 'Parapsychology' started by Anonymous, Mar 29, 2005.

  1. Coal

    Coal Polymath Renaissance Man

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    I'd have thought you could run a decent longitudinal study on this without too much trouble. You might even be able to set up specific forum to do it, simply have people post their dreams that they think might be pre-cognitive in sub forums for specific categories, crashes, coups, earthquakes, and so on and after a time, look at whether the incidence of predictions are greater in the 24 hours before before a such a significant event than not. It might take time to compile the data-set from a (say) years posts, but it would be an interesting experiement.
     
  2. Min Bannister

    Min Bannister Justified & Ancient

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    That is very interesting. I had one myself a few months ago (Virgin planes crashing into Edinburgh Castle) and almost posted it on here but didn't get round to it. I think PeteS may have it as it is a disaster dream that is liable to make the dreamer wake up feeling weird and it is at least plausible if unlikely?
     
  3. stuneville

    stuneville Amministratore principale Staff Member

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    Subtle detail - mine was more a building (a specifically brick-built temple-ish one) having a plane crash into it than vice versa. The building was the first image.

    Also, the plane was a uniformly grey, medium sized airliner, poss an Airbus. No decals or flags, etc.
     
  4. Bigphoot2

    Bigphoot2 Carbon Based Infestation

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    The grey colour scheme suggests a military aircraft to me and they often have low vis markings in a slightly lighter shade of grey.
     
  5. Norville Rogers

    Norville Rogers Fresh Blood

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    Hi everyone, new poster (previous lurker) here.

    =====

    I came to post about a dream I had last night which seemed predictive, so I wanted to put it on record - I've always been interested in weird phenomena and experiences but I have to say I am a sceptic by nature. So I don't think this is a predictive dream, but as there was a specific date in the dream (May 2019) I'll post it anyway. In just over a year we'll know one way or another!

    =====

    Before I get to that, I've been intrigued to read some other posts here. I've always felt that dreams reflect what's going on in our emotional lives through symbolism. For example, as a teenager I dreamed about plane crashes all the time; looking back I now believe that this is a symbolic representation of feeling that my life was out of my own control.

    In my 30s (I'm mod 40s now) I worked at a large organisation where my job involved completing one particular type of large project every six months - it inevitably involved late nights, working weekends and so on. Anyway, for the eight-ten weeks these jobs took over my life I always dreamed of tidal waves - massive walls of water heading towards me, about to engulf me and there was nothing I could do about it.

    These days I'm freelance and typically work on much smaller projects and they are represented in my dreams as animals. If I have a lot of small projects on I dream about rabbits, mice, dogs and cats; if it's a larger project it's a dog or a horse (the size is almost always related to the monetary value of the job). If I feel in control of the work, the animal is obedient and well behaved, if not, I dream about struggling to lead it or control it.

    I've recently taken on a project on a voluntary basis (reluctantly, because the guy who usually does the work is ill and I'm the only one in the group with similar skills) - anyway, when I dreamt about that one the job took the form of a spider the size of a cat, crawling towards me and trying to grab me. My attitude to the job was very much "I don't want to get dragged into this on a permanent basis" so I think that's what influenced my dream's choice of animal! Incidentally, the size of the spider is directly related to what I would charge for the job if it had been a paying gig.

    =====

    I was intrigued by a post in this thread about the death of David Bowie. Of course the original Facebook poster couldn't have known Bowie was going to die, but Bowie himself knew he was dying. And his last video (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lazarus_(David_Bowie_song)#Music_video) is full of death symbolism, so maybe the FB poster saw this and his/her subconscious picked up on the symbolism and re-translated it into a "premonition"? My point being - sometimes we pick up on stuff subconsciously which works its way into our conscious minds via our dreams. Very interesting, but not evidence of precognition.

    =====

    Anyway, here's why I signed up to this forum.

    I had a very vivid dream just before waking up this morning. I was in a library, reading a newspaper, when I realised the date on the newspaper was the future - May 2019. So I started reading about what was going to happen just over a year from now.

    The front page story was about a train crash. It was at "Piccadilly Station" in London and more than one train was involved, so likely a collision. Trains were either leaving or entering the station (maybe both if it was a collision). There were deaths, and the newspaper had printed photos of people who had died. They included young people who had been on their way to a party or event. Survivors reported that power had been lost on the train(s) before the crash.

    As I read (in the dream) I was stunned that I knew this was going to happen in the future, and started to wonder what I could do about it. Who would believe me? (That feeling lingered after I woke up, and if Im honest is what prompted me to write this post here.)

    So I started reading the rest of the paper to see if there was any less dramatic news I could "predict" in order to convince people of the train crash news. Most of the paper was very vague, but there was something about a viral outbreak in central or south America which was somehow having a bad effect on the US economy. The outbreak occurred in late 2018 and the US was dealing with the financial impact in the early part of 2019.

    =====

    When I woke up, it didn't take me long to realise there's one factual inaccuracy in the dream: there is no Piccadilly Station in London. There's Piccadilly Circus - but that's an underground station. There is a Piccadilly Station in Manchester of course.

    As I said, I'm a sceptic. So to call it a genuine precognition, let's say there are certain criteria that need to be met if there's a real train crash in May 2019:

    * fatalities, some being young people on their way to a party or event
    * more than one train involved
    * loss of power beforehand, reported by survivors
    * it happens at Piccadilly Circus in London or Piccadilly Station in Manchester
    * in the news beforehand there's a virus in central/south America which upsets the US economy (optional?)

    =====

    With my rational/skeptic head on, here's some stuff that could have found its way into my subconscious and influenced what I dreamt:

    * a few weeks ago I read Stephen King's "The Bazaar of Bad Dreams" which includes a story about a man whose Kindle gets news reports from the future
    * the two novels I've read since then have both been set in London, and involve people having weird or traumatic experiences there
    * I was emotionally effected by a report on the news the other day, remembering one of the victims of the Manchester arena bombing

    =====

    There you have it - apologies on the long post, I wanted to get the details written down before they faded. I'm looking forward to reading your comments.
     
  6. chicorea

    chicorea Devoted Cultist

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    Your post is remarkable @Norville Rogers, well written, analytical and most than anything well organized. Congratulations.

    This said, there are three things that attracted my attention on your text :

    - This feeling of knowing something beforehand. You mention, at some point, that the feeling of knowing something pushed you to write about it, to let people know about it. Was this feeling caused by the paper you were reading or you felt that you knew the news already and that you were just reading about something that, somehow, you knew?

    - Related to the first point : you read about it, you never witnessed it. I think that this small detail can bear important aspects of your dream. It's about accessing some recorded fact, instead of being there yourself. I guess this is a big departure from your dreams about animals, tidal waves and airplanes, am I right?

    - You say that most of the news on the paper were vague. How so? I mean, were they related to cultural events, sports, gossips... I feel that it can help to understand the context, not of the dream itself, but the paper bringing the news, the media of your precognition.

    Please, I'm sorry if I sound too inquisitve, but this is because your story is very well structured and it makes us want for more details.
     
  7. gattino

    gattino Justified & Ancient

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    It need not necessarily be accurate to be judged precognitive. The way precog dreams are observed to work in terms of news events (which to me are rare..its mostly daily trivia) is that the imagery reflects the person's experience of encountering the story rather than the actual events themselves. The prime example is in JW Dunne's An Experiment With Time. He found he dreamt very vividly of particular disaster which did later occur, but the details in his dream matched the incorrect news reporting of the event rather than the accurate facts of the event itself.

    The other issue, an observation of my own, is that people somehow expect dreams of the future to behave differently from one's inspired by the past. That's to say they expect them to be literal, faithful and detailed. But there's no reason to expect that at all...they are and remain dreams, even if they somehow do contain future information and imagery. And as dreams they get muddled up and go off on a tangent and write their own endings which may be very different from how the event that inspired them ended: whether that event happened yesterday or will happen tomorrow.
     
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  8. Norville Rogers

    Norville Rogers Fresh Blood

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    Cheers!

    The big deal was the reaction I had *within* the dream. I reacted in the dream just as you would in waking life if you found yourself reading next year's newspaper: wow, this is amazing, I must tell someone.

    Good point. I dreamt the act of reading not experiencing. I do often dream of libraries (where I was reading the paper) but usually finding it hard to choose a book.

    Vague in the sense of being blurry and hard to read, like text or numbers often appear in dreams. The headline of the lead story was big, clear text though, something like "disaster death toll rises."

    No problem!
     
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  9. Norville Rogers

    Norville Rogers Fresh Blood

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    Well, I say this with respect, but I'll want accuracy in order to judge it as precognitive. I'm sceptical.

    If there was a train crash somewhere in the world tomorrow, I'd not consider that I'd predicted it. If the details were closer to what I "read" I'd be more likely to by persuaded.

    The clearest thing that rung a bell in my head was the date being so specific. Seriously, I wouldn't have posted here at all if not for that.
     
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  10. gattino

    gattino Justified & Ancient

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    Yes that's perfectly natural. The point is only that things that are genuine may not have the nature we want them to have.
     
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  11. OrsonSwells

    OrsonSwells Junior Acolyte

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    Some years ago I had a very vivid dream about being on holiday with my then girlfriend in a Spanish/Mediterranean kind of resort. We were befriended by an older well-dressed couple called the Lakes and we went out for a drink with them one evening. In the middle of this night out I left the bar we were in to visit a cashpoint - and on my return the Lakes and my girlfriend were gone. Confused, I looked around the town for them but couldn't find them anywhere so returned to the hotel. I went up to our room to find my girlfriend's things gone. In typical dream logic it seemed she had been abducted by the mysterious couple...

    Upon waking I told her about the dream and she was amused by it. Anyway, a few months later we actually did go on holiday to Greece. On the flight we happened to be seated next to an older chap who was with his wife, who was sat on another row. Polite chitchat ensued until my girlfriend asked him where he and his wife were travelling from. "The Lakes," he said. I instantly thought of the dream and felt a chill go straight through me! I reminded my girlfriend about it later and we were both a little freaked out by it.

    Subsequently, the couple did befriend us and we did indeed spend most of our evenings out with them. But I should add it was entirely pleasant and nothing untoward occurred! Still, it was a strange one though...
     
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  12. Schrodinger's Zebra

    Schrodinger's Zebra Who put the writing on the walls?

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    Yes, exactly this. I have a book about Time Storms by Jenny Randles, and one of my favourite stories in there is about a woman who dreamt that she got a phone call saying her boyfriend had been in a motorcycle accident, and in the dream she laughed at the news. When she woke up she was astonished at this as she would never laugh at something so serious.

    Anyway, she told her boyfriend and another friend and they went about their day. But later she got a phone call from the other friend, telling her that her boyfriend had been in a motorcycle accident. And her reaction was to laugh, because she thought her friend was playing tricks on her because of the dream she'd told them about earlier. But it was true, he really had been in an accident.

    But this woman hadn't just dreamt of the upcoming event, she'd dreamt of her exact reaction to said event. And her exact reaction to it is solely because of the dream.

    I love trying to wrap my mind around this story, because cause and effect seems to go right out the window there.
     
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  13. gattino

    gattino Justified & Ancient

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    Speaking of which... my annual attempt to predict the national winner (don't put money on it..i fail every year!).

    This year a slight change of tack. Rather than soley trying to dream or interpret a dream as being relevant to the race, this time I'm attempting to grab the threads of synchronicity.

    A couple of days ago i tried half-heartedly to see the name of the winner in my mind's eye and failed. Shortly thereafter however i started to fall into a nap and jolted myself out of a fully formed dream which involved bullet shaped objects descending vertically from the sky. I wonder if it was linked to the race given a man caught the object with a triumphant "I won!" gesture or air about him.

    So i looked for a horse with a relevant name and saw none.

    Simultaneously the synchronicity idea had come to me. A number of times the winner of the national has had a name relevant to current events. Most notably when Party Politics won during the general election campaign.

    So I was pulled up short this morning when one of the papers had an emblazoned headline referring to Assad as the "gasman". Gasman...the syrian gas attack.. missiles descending over night last night...the Skripals..I made an unrelated gas themed joke the other day too...so it seems gas is in the air, so to speak. There's a horse running called Gas Line Boy.

    Here's the clincher. His rider is called Dunne. As in JW mentioned above in relation to precognitive dreams.

    All of this is embarrassing waffle. Unless it wins. In which case it won't be.
     
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  14. Schrodinger's Zebra

    Schrodinger's Zebra Who put the writing on the walls?

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    I once had a precognitive thing regarding the Grand National, but it wasn't a dream so I'm not sure what thread to put it in.
     
  15. gattino

    gattino Justified & Ancient

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    He never even got a mention. This is why psychics are all fakes. I'd never trust a word I say.
     
    Last edited: Apr 14, 2018
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  16. OrsonSwells

    OrsonSwells Junior Acolyte

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    Actually, this reminds me that at some time in the mid 90s I had a dream about winning the lottery. I remembered the numbers the next day so put a bet on them. Quite remarkably, the first two numbers that came out matched two I had dreamt of. Unfortunately, of course, the next two were wrong but the fifth was also one of the numbers from the dream. Even so, I would have thought the odds of dreaming three correct numbers would be quite high.
     
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  17. chicorea

    chicorea Devoted Cultist

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    Were the two numbers that missed the mark related, in any way, to the other two that were on the lottery result? Like an inverted number, for instance : 24 became 42. Or the exact half, I don't know...
     
  18. OrsonSwells

    OrsonSwells Junior Acolyte

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    I do seem to remember the incorrect numbers being fairly close in some way to the numbers I dreamt. I can't recall how though due to the passage of time.
     
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  19. Dr_Baltar

    Dr_Baltar Left Foot of God

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    Dreaming about them doesn't make the odds any higher or lower than any other way of picking them. Under the mid-nineties rules, that was approx 1 in 57.
     

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