Alientology

Discussion in 'Religions & Cults' started by pepe, Aug 12, 2017 at 9:24 AM.

  1. Merle

    Merle Dog Dreaming

    Messages:
    28
    Likes Received:
    56
    Trophy Points:
    13
    Not sure if this is directed to me or not but if it is then nah, I never said it was my way of thinking.

    It was just a generalisation of the reasoning and logic I've seen used by some people to justify to themselves, a way to make sense of their belief in both the science based Evolution and the religious based Creation...
     
  2. pepe

    pepe Phantom

    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    51
    Trophy Points:
    18
    lol, no Dingo it's my blood they want and i'm spilling.
     
    Merle likes this.
  3. Merle

    Merle Dog Dreaming

    Messages:
    28
    Likes Received:
    56
    Trophy Points:
    13
    Oh dear... that doesn't sound too good pepe... now you'll just have to unspill yourself to be able to reverse this spillage of blood... lol...
     
    pepe likes this.
  4. pepe

    pepe Phantom

    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    51
    Trophy Points:
    18
    I'm getting killed out there. Taken many head shots but nothing below the belt as yet.
     
    Merle likes this.
  5. Merle

    Merle Dog Dreaming

    Messages:
    28
    Likes Received:
    56
    Trophy Points:
    13
    As you know, anecdotal evidence is just that, a personal subjective experience and unless you can be more specific by providing some sort of tangible objective evidence, I'm afraid your blood is not just going to keep spilling but it will spill over following you around like a shadow wherever you go...

    Anecdotal evidence is like wetting your pants, everyone can see it but only you can feel it.... lol...
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2017 at 3:44 PM
  6. pepe

    pepe Phantom

    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    51
    Trophy Points:
    18
    I did wet them and i guess some sense it like blood. Brave or stupid i started it and will take full resposibility if anyone feels the need to run me through as i am out in the open without any hard evidence and have wandered into a mine field of common sense.
     
  7. Merle

    Merle Dog Dreaming

    Messages:
    28
    Likes Received:
    56
    Trophy Points:
    13
    Nothing like sticking to your resolve regardless if you are believed or not... though my quote about pissing your pants didn't quite fit into being seen as anecdotal evidence but it does sound good...

    Anyway, wandering into a mine field of common sense and taking head shots is much more gentle than to be wandering into a mine field and being blown up from below the belt...
     
  8. pepe

    pepe Phantom

    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    51
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Sticking is no problem as it is stuck to me, infact this could well be the stickiest situation since Sticky the stick insect got stuck to a sticky bun.
     
    Ermintruder likes this.
  9. PeteByrdie

    PeteByrdie Privateer in the service of Princess Frideswide

    Messages:
    1,887
    Likes Received:
    1,310
    Trophy Points:
    113
    LOCATION:
    The high seas
    TWITTER:
    PeteByrdie
    All this talk of blood spilling is making me uncomfortable.lol But, pepe, you laid your cards down early on and you've accepted acerbic responses in good cheer. I think you're wrong but you're alright in my book.

    We've stumbled before over the discussion of the creation of the Universe (multiverse) on this forum. I don't think there's a demonstrable solution on the horizon to how the our reality could have emerged from nowhere, or how from whatever, or by whomever, emerged the Universe itself emerged from nowhere. We've found that to be an inscrutable problem and an intractable discussion. That there are things at work we don't understand is clear, but filling the gaps with personal belief is not something with which we forteans are inclined to be satisfied.
     
  10. Coal

    Coal Sure, we're all wrong. Makes complete sense.

    Messages:
    4,683
    Likes Received:
    4,726
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Not at all! A line of thought isn't necessarily and doesn't have to be logical.
     
  11. jimv1

    jimv1 Analogue Boy

    Messages:
    7,287
    Likes Received:
    3,833
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I think your problem started in the first sentence of your initial post stating that creation was a certainty. It may be to you but you'd have to prove that before we go further with the argument. If you could do that, you'd be the wisest of wise men but for Forteans, there's a radar ping right there. A statement like that led me to think there are assumptions and flaws in the rest of your reasoning.

    I've read a lot of books on a lot of spooky subjects and many of them go like this...

    Chapter 1
    A broad outline of the subject backed up with demonstrable scientific facts.
    A closing paragraph, designed to be a page turner along the lines of 'But what if Santa is just a construction of Elvish Northern beings?'

    By Chapter 3, the author's thrust is now intimating that the Northern Elves Controlling Santa, having stated it previously on the back of other scientific facts is also true and has been proved.

    Through further chapters, evidence is presented about Elves and Santa which hold up in context to the book but because the initial premise is flawed, doesn't really hold any weight outside the narrative the author is pushing.

    Having got a fair way through the book, the authr feels the need to reward with a twist or revelation. This may come via a line along the lines of 'In February 89 a document came into my possession...' Of course the provenance of this information cannot be revealed for some reason but believe me, it's a total justification of eveything you've been reading.

    By now, you as a reader are complicit in his theory. You've invested money in buying the book and time reading it. He's got your cash and he's given you magic beans.

    Being sensible, I tumbled this ruse and said 'Wait a minute' at the end of Chapter 1.
    Others miss this and soak it up.

    This is my thoughts on it all anyway.
     
    skinny, Ermintruder and Mythopoeika like this.
  12. dr wu

    dr wu Doctor Prog

    Messages:
    445
    Likes Received:
    257
    Trophy Points:
    63
    This reminds me a little of a thread here a while back where the OP stated that by his logic, which he presented in his opening post, it's all a 'supernatural creation'......this one is postulating space aliens in lieu of a supernatural deity.
     
    pepe and Ermintruder like this.
  13. jimv1

    jimv1 Analogue Boy

    Messages:
    7,287
    Likes Received:
    3,833
    Trophy Points:
    113
     
  14. Coal

    Coal Sure, we're all wrong. Makes complete sense.

    Messages:
    4,683
    Likes Received:
    4,726
    Trophy Points:
    113
    In most completely bogus lines of reasoning the dodgy bit is usually right at the start and briskly dealt with.

    When you're in that position, that of thinking "I know this is bollocks but I can't put my finger on it...", check the very first part of the argument, or its premise. That's usually where the weasel words are.
     
    Ermintruder likes this.
  15. pepe

    pepe Phantom

    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    51
    Trophy Points:
    18
    My problem has been componded by some not quoting my exact words, i did use the word almost in this case and the word style in another but lets not split atoms, i know what you mean.

    So those who feel we are here as just a matter of chance still face the same set of quetions. How did it all come to be ? If nothing is by design, why has life taken form from inanimate matter ?

    To me a God in heaven and a Devul in hell is way more out there than another civilization being our origin, as we are a living example of that possibility.
     
  16. pepe

    pepe Phantom

    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    51
    Trophy Points:
    18
    I never expected one single person to come forward and agree, let me just say that first. Of course i'm probably wrong and anyone who makes a claim to know what it's all about will probably be wrong.

    Reasoning with the origins of life is something many chose not to enter for fear of ridicule but i'm not one of those people, my theroy stands the same as it ever has and always will, until we know the what, why and how, which i know some will say is impossible but i beg to differ, we are learning more everyday and in time i think the likelihood of finding others in the universe before Jesus or God shows up is a pretty safe bet.
     
    Merle likes this.
  17. pepe

    pepe Phantom

    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    51
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Thanks Pete and yes i did show my hand a bit quick but i've always liked that about others, so i follow their lead. You are more than likely correct in me being wrong but until we know different it's what i'm going with.
     
  18. UnknownUnknown

    UnknownUnknown Yeti

    Messages:
    138
    Likes Received:
    242
    Trophy Points:
    43
    And you've hit on one of the great strengths of the board I reckon. Folk here are generally extremely supportive over accounts of subjective truth. People post accounts of things that they feel have happened to them, and how that experience made them feel. No-one will say that they are 'wrong' in this sense.

    But that single experience or feeling is not the same as objective truth. That same poster may well be called out if they explain their anecdote in dogmatic terms, or claim that it definitively proves x y or z.

    I'm always more interested in the story than the explanation anyway, personally! For what's it's worth.

    I'm not with you on your 'logic' here but I'm really impressed with your cheerful responses. And very relieved that you don't claim to have any dramatic secret evidence that you can't show us (unfortunately that seems to happen a lot). :dunno:
     
  19. Ermintruder

    Ermintruder Existential pixelfixer

    Messages:
    3,537
    Likes Received:
    3,627
    Trophy Points:
    113
    LOCATION:
    Proximate
    @pepe ... I believe we all should guard against the self-assured, yet-flawed, certainty that emerges from this instance of the anthropic principle. Humanity may be no more perfect or privileged than a semi-sentient bacteria that swarms and multiplies upon a singular rotting apple.

    We repeatedly rediscover our unique heritage, entitlement and destiny, within clan clusters across that apple, each of which knows with absolute certainty that it is right, and the rest are wrong. Science can also often fall into one of these similar self-dug pits of damnation, but it redeems itself (usually) by retaining true objectivity.

    One of the strongest arguments against creationism (either by an indefineable supreme being, or alien overlords) is the fundamentally-flawed nature of physical biological existence.

    Back nearly quarter of a century ago, I watched Dawkins explain to children, on the RI Christmas lectures, about how we understandably (but unforgivably) tend to misidentify the difference between design and designoid life processes.

    He explained, back then, with irrefutable logic, that the biological eye (indeed, all animal perceptual vision) was the product of multiple expedient evolutionary processes, and therefore fundamentally-flawed. It only appears to be designed, by those who hide behind the small foothills of 'irreducable complexity'.

    • This biological system looks complicated (mamallian eyes).

    • It appears superficially-similar to mechanical analogues (cameras, telescopes)

    • This cannot have emerged from nothing: order from chaos makes no sense.

    • Therefore a creator god, or supreme alien being, created life.
    Wrong. The above points are all a false corollary...(or at least they are, for now).

    We, as open-minded Forteans, would always hope to find the ultimate truths, behind every curtain. However, we absolutely must place our faith in observable scientific evidence: therefore, the conclusions of The Blind Watchmaker and The Selfish Gene &cetera must hold sway over The Book of Genesis, the Dreamtime of the Old Ones and the Bhagavad Gita.
     
    EnolaGaia, PeteByrdie, jimv1 and 4 others like this.
  20. pepe

    pepe Phantom

    Messages:
    50
    Likes Received:
    51
    Trophy Points:
    18
    I can't prove a thing but will say i have found some peace of mind in what i think as true, if that makes any sense.

    All logic in this realm is flawed in one way or another and that leaves the door open for folk to make what they will of it. Some just don't like the subject to be broached as it always leads to folk thinking that one is claiming a higher ground over others. I don't suffer from that but fully understand why some do.

    Very nice of you to call my responses as cheerful, thank you. What i have posted here is not meant to rock any boats and only posted in an enquiring fasion. Which is probably not as it came across originally. So sorry if any toes got trod on.
     
    UnknownUnknown, Ermintruder and Merle like this.

Share This Page